Former President Donald Trump sat down with popular podcaster Joe Rogan on Friday, sparking a three-hour conversation that quickly veered into Trump's long-held claims that the 2020 election was "stolen." Throughout the episode, Rogan repeatedly pressed Trump for concrete evidence supporting his allegations of widespread election fraud, but the former president's responses were largely vague and unsupported.
The exchange took place during episode #2219 of The Joe Rogan Experience, where Trump claimed the 2020 election was "the most crooked election." Despite repeated attempts by Rogan to elicit specific examples of how the election was rigged, Trump's answers remained broad and unsubstantiated, prompting Rogan to laugh at several points.
"I wanna talk about 2020 because you said over and over again that you were robbed in 2020," Rogan began. "How do you think you were robbed?"
Trump responded by reiterating his belief that illegal changes to voting procedures had occurred. "They were supposed to get legislative approval to do the things they did, and they didn't get it," Trump claimed, referring to states that extended voting deadlines or allowed mail-in voting during the COVID-19 pandemic. However, when Rogan pressed him for specifics, Trump's answers became increasingly murky.
"Give me some examples of how," Rogan pushed.
Trump, deflecting from a direct answer, responded, "Anything," before pivoting to alleged issues in Wisconsin, where he claimed ballots were mishandled. "They wouldn't give access in certain areas to the ballots because the ballots weren't signed," Trump added, although he did not provide evidence to back this up.
Throughout the conversation, Rogan seemed unconvinced by Trump's explanations, at one point laughing as the former president struggled to present clear evidence. Rogan asked, "Are you gonna present this ever?" to which Trump hesitated before launching into a tangent about Hunter Biden's laptop and the involvement of intelligence agencies.
Trump continued, "Fifty-one intelligence agents lied, they lied. They knew it was Hunter's laptop, they said it was from Russia. Russia, Russia, Russia." While the Hunter Biden laptop story did play a significant role in the 2020 election media narrative, Trump's attempt to link it to his election fraud claims appeared to fall flat with Rogan, who repeatedly asked for more concrete details that Trump never fully delivered.
Trump's persistent claims of election fraud have become a cornerstone of his 2024 presidential campaign, despite the fact that no evidence has emerged to support his assertions of widespread fraud in 2020. Even so, Trump doubled down on these accusations during the podcast, repeating the now-familiar refrain that "the election was rigged, robbed, and stolen."
The conversation also shifted to Trump's ongoing legal battles, which include federal charges related to his efforts to overturn the 2020 election. Trump has been indicted both in Washington, D.C., and in Georgia, where prosecutors accuse him of pressuring state officials to alter election results. The former president has pleaded not guilty to all charges, and his legal team continues to maintain that his efforts were part of legitimate challenges to what he believes were fraudulent election processes.
For Rogan, known for his wide-ranging and often provocative interviews, this episode offered a platform for Trump to restate his grievances, but it also highlighted the gaps in Trump's argument. Despite being offered a national stage with millions of listeners, Trump failed to deliver the kind of evidence that might sway public opinion in his favor. Rogan's repeated prodding for specifics ultimately resulted in a conversation that felt circular, with Trump recycling familiar claims without providing new information or proof.
The interview lasted longer than expected, delaying Trump's appearance at a rally later that day in Traverse City, Michigan. The event drew considerable attention as many of Trump's supporters, after waiting for hours, began leaving the venue before Trump arrived. While the rally was initially seen as a key moment in Trump's campaign, his delayed appearance underscored the logistical challenges he faces as he balances both legal battles and a presidential run.
At the Michigan rally, Trump repeated his claim that he had won the 2020 election, telling the crowd, "We won, we won, we did win. It was a rigged election, it was a rigged election." The former president also took a jab at Vice President Kamala Harris, who is his main rival in the 2024 race. "You have to tell Kamala Harris, that's why I'm doing it again," Trump said, referring to his bid for the White House. "If I thought I lost, I wouldn't be doing this again."
